Liberate yourself from masturbation shame

with Alex de la Cruz

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Alex de la Cruz started his career in advertising and moved into product design, specializing in drinkware and dinnerware for some of the largest retailers in the country. After 15 years, he felt stagnate and needed a change. His creativity, innovation and own traumatic personal journey led to the beginnings of Bator Balm, a men’s edging lubricant that enhances the bating experience and has strengthened a sense of community among bators. In this Smart Sex, Smart Love podcast, Alex tells his story of masturbation shame, how he overcame it, how Bator Balm has become a household name among bators, and why he organizes the annual Sausage Fest in Las Vegas.

Hello everyone and welcome to Smart sex smart love we’re talking about sex goes beyond the taboo and talking about love goes beyond the honeymoon. My guest today is Alex De La Cruz, a creative and versatile designer who began his career in advertising and graphic design, where he focused on business development and marketing strategies. He then switched to product design specializing in housewares for outdoor use. Alex designed innovative and stylish drinkware and dinnerware for retailers for more than 15 years. He uses his skills and experience to pursue his passion project, Vader balm, a men’s edging lubricant that enhances the baiting experience and fosters a sense of community among baiters. Alec hosts the annual beta event in Las Vegas called sausage fest, which aims to facilitate deeper community connections. The event is a fun and inclusive vacation for baiters of all backgrounds, ages and cultures. If you saw the 2013 Comedy Mystery web series, where are the bears, you’ll see Alex who played a small rugby player. Sorry, that was called the where the bears are. Today Alex will talk about liberating yourself from masturbation shame. Welcome, Alex. Thank you for having me. Oh, I’m so happy to have you. I’ve been looking forward to this show for a long time. Because we talked about who to have on my show. And we found you. And so much of what I I’ve learned about this because I coined the term side. You might do you know that that I did that? Yes. That’s amazing. And thank you.

My best thing I’ve done in my field. So I started a side guys Facebook group. And I have learned so much about baiting from side guys who that’s a large part of what OSI does. And so I’m hoping we’re going to learn more from you today. And I’ll always

Speaker 1 1:53
excellent, I’m excited to share my point of view in this subject. And I hope it reflects to other people to meet

Joe. So let’s just dive right in. So everyone’s gonna ask because I thought the same thing. You design this drinkware and dinnerware, and then Bader ball. This is unusual transition, we talked about how this happened and how you came up with the idea of beta ball.

Sure. So I’m Creative At Heart and got my start in advertising, then transition to product design, which was lucky because the company that I worked for, is had a small art department and I kind of had to wear multiple hats. And I was able to create 3d molds of dinnerware and drinkware and design the graphics that go on them. And we sold them to retailers like Target Walmart, Macy’s, and I was there for 15 years and honed my skills and, you know, got experience with packaging, product design, of course, and you know, creating things that we think would appeal to the customers. But I was stagnant there. I couldn’t move up. And which was fine. And I thought like the one way to get out of this is create my variable product and what would that be? And I think that was, you know, what I love to do most is jerking off.

Yeah, right. That’s awesome. I think a lot of people what comes from their products come from even therapy, you know, specializations a lot of us who specialize in whatever we specialize is because we’re affected by or we’re living that way. So it makes sense.


Can you explain for our listeners what the term bater means for those who may not know

Speaker 1 3:49
bater as I understand it, is it’s short for Master baiter. Essentially, it’s somebody who, who prefers to masturbate over over, you know, intercourse, penetrative intercourse and over vaginal. And for someone to call themselves a beta. I mean, everyone’s everyone, I feel maybe 99% of humans masturbate. Whether they admit it or not, but if one is a beta, if they prefer to just masturbate alongside with a man or by themselves, yeah.

Right. And it can be kind of what may be a better

Speaker 1 4:40
I would say so. I mean, I’m not an expert in the female masturbation part, but like, I’ve heard of women who, you know, who enjoy masturbation themselves.

Yeah. Yeah. I just wonder if they’re in these if they have the cut because like what I’ve learned in my side group, is that there are and I think I knew this as a therapist, but I didn’t really I didn’t they didn’t stick with me that there are groups for guys that are their Beta groups, right? Yes. And then they have rules and regulations. And I let a straight man go to these things. I’ve also understood Oh,

Speaker 1 5:11
yes. There’s lots of group. Masturbation groups that gather, maybe monthly, most of the big cities, and I’m happy to say that I support some of them. I provide their loop.

Which let’s get right into that. So why did you create this Bader ball, which is loop, right? Yes,

Speaker 1 5:35
it is. Essentially, being a beta for years. I found the beta community using Abilene, which is a women’s product. For the face, it removes makeup, it’s a makeup remover, and we kind of just the beta just kind of, you know, took it and found out that it’s great for hedging because it lasts a long time. And there were as a beta hat. Using it, I say, sorry, as a product designer, I found issues with it. And I wanted to see if there was a way to enhance the product, so that it pays attention to the beta. And you know, solves my issues. One of them is that Abilene is very sticky. It’s hard to wipe off when you’re done. The packaging is this giant white tub with a blue lid and it says makeup remover or removes makeup. So you know, it’s like it doesn’t. If somebody came up to, you know, in your room and seizes, how would you explain that?

Makeup remover or my bathing balm?

Speaker 1 6:49
Exactly, yeah. And then. And also, you know, they don’t really support the community, or they don’t want to recognize community, which is understandable because we are not their market. Right. And I created a bit of off to solve those issues. So that, you know, I think, I think, I think we deserve some attention. And you know, something designed just for us. And I and my, my solution seems to be resonating, which is nice.

I’m so glad to hear that. Now, some of my listeners won’t know what edging means. I know what it means. But can you explain that?

Speaker 1 7:27
Sure. So edging is essentially the act of masturbation and bringing yourself just close enough to the edge without going over. Some people like to fine tune it, you know, they get into this meditative state and they, they just just kind of see when when they get to the SD is slow down. And just keep it there for as long as they can. Some people can’t without orgasm, and some guys can’t do that. So what they would do is just stop, hold back for just a few seconds, and then start over. And, you know, depending on your stamina, or how long how much time you have or how long you want to go. Some guys can go for hours. I’ve heard of people go for five hours. My average is probably two hours.

Now what’s the point? People are gonna say? What’s the point? Why not just come when you want to come?

Speaker 1 8:28
Right? You know, for me, I can’t speak for everyone but for me, it’s it becomes this. This type of meditation. I have a lot of anxiety. I think a lot my brain goes 1000 miles an hour right now because I’m also nervous. But when I’m in that state, it’s just this kind of like a centering and just focusing on your body, on your mind and on your desires. And allowing yourself to cut in a way it’s kind of like peaceful it’s very, very fulfilling. And I mean, you know, I enjoy jerking off and prolonging it is nice.

Have you always been this open about it? Or we did you have your own masturbation shame.

Speaker 1 9:20
Oh, my goodness, I was okay, so we’re gonna jump right into it. I the way what happened to me was I was caught masturbating. And we really yes and and then this this person made me feel funny about it kind of laughed, looked at me appointed and then ran off and you know what I assume he he went around telling everybody and you know, that’s when I felt so much shame. And because of, you know, financial circumstances, my parents weren’t around, they loved me, but just, you know, they just weren’t around. And I didn’t have anybody to talk to, or somebody to, to console me. And, you know, and make me feel good about it or, you know, like, talk it out if I had to keep it all on my, for myself. And, and I think that was very dramatic, because because it, it affects me to this day, shame imprint, it was it was, and to, you know, to this day, every time I masturbate, or after I climax, I just have this this nagging feeling in the back of my head that’s like, why did you do that? Or like, or, you know, like, it’s feel this shame. And, and it’s hard to get rid of, I don’t think it’s ever gonna get rid of, I think I just need to be to learn how to manage it. You know, and remember, and thank God for my partner, I love them gives me a lot of reassurance. Which is, which is for me is key. That’s

JOE KORT 11:13
great. And it’s great that from that, it didn’t just stop you from creating this product, but also allowing yourself to enjoy it and not keep pursuing it. Correct? Yeah. You know, I know a lot of therapists, and I think I know, I used to be one of them. I shouldn’t think I know that, you know, because I always thought I should be having intercourse even though homicide. And I used to get clients that only that mostly or solely liked masturbating. So they were a beta. And I didn’t understand, you know, we learned early on in the field, that, you know, you had maybe attachment issues, you weren’t fully developed, you weren’t mature. And I don’t believe any of that anymore. I believe what you are talking about for yourself is this is your erotic life. Outer course, is sexual enough. Is that what you’re saying? Isn’t it?

Speaker 1 12:01
Yeah, that’s a good way to put it. Um, I think, I think masturbation becomes like, you know, this self soothing this, this mechanism to just to just love yourself or take care of yourself, you know, give yourself permission to, to, to, to enjoy your body, and not need anyone necessarily, you know, to satisfy that. Which is, I think is nice, you know, self sufficiency is well, I learned that being you know, kind of growing up alone. That’s, I think that’s a nice virtue to have this list is to be able to take care of yourself.

JOE KORT 12:37
And what about can you describe without giving away any obviously confidentiality, but of the idea of what happens in these beta groups, because people would be interested in this, like, and especially, you know, it’s so this the whole baiting thing smacks right into the my other work, which is straight men who have sex with men or are sexual with men, and people are shocked when they learn that straight men will go into these real circles and watch each other and masturbating. Can you describe what goes on?

Speaker 1 13:04
Sure. So I would say there’s different formats. I mean, they’ll you know, stray away from the general you know, where they are together and place and and stripped down and you know, they get their bones on and just enjoy each other. Generally, it’s this act of like, you know, it’s like a camaraderie kind of thing knowing that everybody’s there to take care of themselves and enjoy the visual aspect of like seeing another man masturbate and not have the pressure the of of the typical or the consensus that sex is penetrative you know, because not everybody is comfortable with with no sex my my reasons were, I had difficulty with with meaning guys, and it was just tough.

JOE KORT 14:05
Guys for just this. You mean?

Speaker 1 14:07
Yes. It was pretty tough. Yeah. And you know, because you can be called out like, like, if you said, That’s all you’re into, and still say like, oh, that’s boring. I want to do more you know, and it’s like, and you get dismissed. So this is an opportunity for for you know, baiters to join a group and, and enjoy the act of masturbation. Now, there are rules just so that you know, we can respect everybody. Generally, it’s, you know, you don’t do anything without consent. You have to have consent, if you want to interact with somebody, which is nice. And they go on usually for two to four hours. When you’re done, then you just clean up and off you go. And, and there’s there’s, there’s no guilt or shame or repercussions. And I hope and you know, do it again next month.

JOE KORT 15:03
I’ve heard don’t maybe I don’t since I’ve never been to one of these. I’ve just heard that there’s rules like nothing from the waist down, you can interact only from the waist up. Is that correct? Oh, correct. Yeah.

Speaker 1 15:13
So I mean, I don’t want to be the voice for these groups. But the way I understand it is that there is no touching allowed unless, like, there’s no oral sex allowed. There’s no penetrative sex allowed. It’s all masturbation. You have to ask permission to be able to grab someone and you know, help them out with their tool. And, yes, yeah, I think some some groups allow kissing, maybe some nipple nipple looking, but um, definitely no oral sex, and no, no sex.

JOE KORT 15:52
Got it. And then you also talk about sexual trauma and shame and masturbation as well as sexual healing and liberation. Will you share your thoughts on those things connected?

Speaker 1 16:02
Sure. So my situation was, like I said, Before, my parents weren’t around and I didn’t have you know, the, the I, I missed out on the, the parenting part. And I kind of had to be self sufficient and a lot of things including my emotions, and I’d solve problems on my own. And then I was caught masturbating. And with the shame that came with that, you know, it traumatized me. And I, and, and finding out that I’m not into penetrative sex, I was just into masturbation. But every time I jerked off, I was shamed, or I felt shamed. And going up, slowly, I found out that, you know, that’s not right. It’s like, I’m punishing myself. I can’t do that. So when I finally started, you know, exploring, meeting up with men. I asked, I was definitely afraid of STDs, you know, because that was like the big thing in the 90s and 2000s. And, you know, I was I was careful. And I asked this, my first hookup was this guy, I asked him if he was clean, he said, Yes. week later, I felt like a burning sensation. Socially. I got Gonorrhea. And because I didn’t have, you know, somebody to talk to that experience was just dramatic, you know, having to look it up what this sensation was about and going to, to the clinic, and then they ask you 20 questions, like, really personal questions. It was just all of it was just awful. And I had trust issues. So from then on, I interest anyone, and to prevent getting STDs in the future. I just stayed with jerking

JOE KORT 18:00
off. Okay, I was gonna say, because what you do with them, obviously was more than jerking off to get gonorrhea,

Speaker 1 18:05
right. Yes. Oh, yes. So, so yeah. Um, and, and that’s kind of how I kind of funneled myself into jerking off. Omona like, you know, and and then I found the community bait world, this this website, bait, which is a community for men’s. It’s a it’s like a Facebook and social media. For men who enjoy masturbating. You can post pictures and videos and share stories. And they also have a video chat room, which is always on. But you know, it’s really nice, because it’s reaffirming, it’s affirming that there are other men out there who are just like you, and it’s, you know, shows you that it’s, it’s nothing to be ashamed about. And it’s just support groups. And, and I don’t know, I owe a lot of a lot of gratitude for bait world because it kind of it’s kind of how beta bombs started. You know, that’s how I found out about Abilene and stuff.

JOE KORT 19:09
Oh, because guys, we’re using that and then you exactly hmm.

Speaker 1 19:13
And that’s how that’s how I started beta bomb thinking like, well, maybe I need to create something that’s designed just for us, you know, like a beginning to end experience that takes care of our needs.

JOE KORT 19:28
I think it’s important for me to also say that while this is great that you have this lube and that a lot of guys use lube, it’s also okay not to use lube. There’s a lot of guys that’s not conscious because they don’t like blue, right? You probably

Speaker 1 19:39
yes. Oh, absolutely. Yeah, it’s definitely you know, there’s people who like to try to bake dry. But I am proud to say that I’ve had guys who are Dr. ators that I’ve converted. That’s I feel so good.

JOE KORT 19:58
That’s awesome. That’s good to know. Yeah. Keep that in mind when I’m talking to clients who are baiters?

Speaker 1 20:04
Sure? Yeah, I mean, you know, it doesn’t hurt to try it. Like it’s all about experimenting, right? Finding out what, what sensations you like. You just You just, you know, sometimes you could go on forever dry, or you could go, you know, wet masturbating for years, and then you try dry one time, and then you’re like, Oh, I’d like that sensation is different. So let’s try it. So I’m not pushing for Bierbaum to be like, the prime experience. It’s, it’s just a way to enhance the experience. If, if you want to try nothing,

JOE KORT 20:42
it’s great. Well, how do you respond to somebody that does say to you, it’s kind of boring, and you’re not fully evolved? And how can we not fucking you know, I’m sure you get all?

Speaker 1 20:53
Yeah, first I, what I tend to say is, is what’s wrong with that? Are you trying to say I’m, I should be ashamed that I don’t like penetrative sex? Like who said that was the right way to go. One thing about about being shamed as is, is no one could really shame you. Unless you have reassurance on yourself that you’re okay with it. Yeah, I mean, I think I feel like no one can shame you. With your truth. Your your your honesty with yourself. Yeah. So if somebody tells me that, I would tell them Well, that’s how you think that’s how I feel. And this is the way I like it. And I won’t, I don’t see how, how you feel is going to try to make me change myself.

JOE KORT 21:46
Like a confidence around it. So that because no one can shame you if you can’t be shamed. If it doesn’t, you don’t feel shamed about it. People can say whatever they want, you’re not going to.

Speaker 1 21:55
Right, exactly. And I guess that’s kind of what Beethoven was trying to do is, like, instill this pride in yourself care. You know, kind of like, what, like, the reason why the jar is designed such a way, you know, like, it doesn’t, it doesn’t look somebody or, you know, it’s masculine, and it’s like, you put it on the shelf, and it looks fine. You know, it’s, you’re not going to run and hide. Yeah. And I’ve had, you know, maybe I’m jumping here, but I’ve had men who reached out and email me saying they had shame about their masturbation, and were afraid to tell their partners. Yeah. And when I released the product, they bought it, this person bought it and showed it to his to his partner and said, you know, this is what I like, and you know, and basically, he was able to give him some confidence to tell his partner and now they just have a much more much more honest and closer relationship.

JOE KORT 23:00
That make you feel great. We are changing the world one beta at a time.

Speaker 1 23:08
Yeah, it’s really nice, because I’m telling you, like, I kind of struggle with it still myself. My husband just, you know, takes care of you so much. This kind of like, my protest to the people that shame you like, no, like, no, no, I proud. You’re not gonna make me feel bad about this. I’m gonna live my life, my husband the wearable?

JOE KORT 23:32
Well, I’m so appreciative that you let your emotions out during this podcast. You know, I know that people would hear this and maybe read the, you know, the podcasts and gonna want to listen, or whatever. It’s not about smut. It’s about self pleasure and your your passion about it. Thanks

Speaker 1 23:49
for pointing that out. You know, and, and I hope perfect that I’m on your podcast, because, you know, it’s the side you coined the term side. And, you know, and I feel like it’s like, kind of like giving a reassurance again, to other to other men that hey, side. Lifestyle is great. Yes. It might be the cure for overpopulation, too.

JOE KORT 24:14
Well, I honestly, yeah. I just think that I actually because, you know, I’m 16 So I went through that whole HIV crisis and leave that I made it through without getting HIV because I didn’t, I wasn’t having intersex. And I know there are other ways to get it but I think that that that’s why I’m

Speaker 1 24:32
Gosh, you have that was the other thing that was traumatizing me when I was you know, barely exploring sexuality is like, one of the times I hooked up with a guy It’s so silly, but like, you know, his he ejaculated and semen landed on the on the tip of my on the head of my penis, and I just freaked out freaked the hell out of Google. Can I Can they get as HIV Eat etc. Am I gonna die the next day? You know, like if I sleep, why not wake up all of these questions. It was awful. It was just awful.

JOE KORT 25:08
So much misinformation back then, you know? Yeah, yeah. Before we have five more minutes and I want to make sure you talk about this sausage fest in Las Vegas what it is, and just tell us all about it.

Speaker 1 25:19
Yes. So, you know, I want to because of beta bomb success, I’m able to create this event that aims to gather the whole purpose is to get baiters together and you know, create a community and kind of bonded a little more in a lot of the barriers is cost for some, you know, jerk off events around work. Our solution, my solution is, you know, bring it to Vegas. It’s the city is designed to have everybody come in as easily as possible. Hotels, rates are cheap. So you know, that, that benefits, you know, that lowers the threshold so that more guys can come. And we had our technically second one last year, I hosted a bar mixer, you know, so that, you know, to kind of have everybody talk and share experiences. And then after that, we walked over to the local sex club, which is a block away. And they went and had the biggest party and that’s excellent ever. And we’re doing it again this spring. And in May five may 5 to the eighth. It is baiters only very strictly bidders only because you know, we, we want that we want them to have their space, their safe space. And because of that, it is bait only invite. And that’s the only way you can find information. So please sign up. And then and if you want to check it out, I think you would have fun. And it’s it’s a very inclusive event. All agent mostly adult only. Yeah. And there’s no there’s no put that’s very hot body positive. I had a survey sent out and I asked them Did you feel this was a body positive group and the majority 90% or more said yes. So I’m very proud of that. You

JOE KORT 27:29
should be you should be. Where can people find me? We’ll have all these links, you know, on the website. Where can people find beta bomb? Because I’m sure you can’t go into CVS and

correct. I mean, hopefully one day but you can get it at beta It’s also available online.

I mean, I’m sorry, brick and mortar stores in San Francisco. A store called does your mother know? I love that name. Every time I say I say like this gesture mother now.

Mr. S leather. They just picked us up in LA Rough Trade gear, Palm Springs, gear leather. And in Fort Lauderdale at leatherworks. So support your local businesses. Guys.

JOE KORT 28:20
I know you should really look at here locally we have in Detroit with something called noir leather. And it’s a leather store. But I’ll bet that

they would sell that. Oh, that would be nice. Yeah, totally reach out.

JOE KORT 28:30
I’ll tell you about it. Is there anything we didn’t say that you want to make sure is said about your product about baiting about anything.

My head is everywhere. But maybe I just want to say that, you know, beta bomb is for the Vader’s. By abator. We the company aims to create products that service leaders in their needs. Check out our website and our philosophy. And if you agree, support us, and we’ll take care of you. This

JOE KORT 29:04
is great. Alex, thank you so so much for being on my show. And I appreciate all your feelings and just your passion and your heart in this whole thing.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. Oh, glad to be

JOE KORT 29:17
great. No, me too. So, like I said, Thank you for joining me on smart sex smart love. You can hear more on my podcast at Smart sex smart It’s also at Joe You can just hit on podcast. It’s on Apple Spotify everywhere you can get a podcast and you can also follow me on Twitter Tiktok, Instagram and Facebook. And my handle is at Dr. Joe court everywhere. So I hope everyone enjoyed this and we’ll see you next time.